My own blog

Posting last 6 results, Any feed back welcome.
Hypo since '97,on 100mcg until 2002. Medicated Thyroxine
(Levothyroxine)

Date: TSH FT4
(mU/L) (pmol/L)
(0.4-4.0) (10.3-19.4)
21/08/01 0.14 18.6 (sym. worsen,doc refuse to up meds)
25/02/02 4.08 13.5 (sym.worsen,new doc dx Hashi,125mcg.)
22/04/02 0.04 22.5 (lab said over replaced)
30/08/02 0.02 25.6 (lab said over replaced)
14/02/03 <0.01 24.9 (incr.
12/05/03 <0.01 23.2 (Still 150mcg, lab said adequate T4)

For those who have serious problems -- endometriosis, and the others mentioned by Linda below -- I think this is an awesome option. But the idea of a natural, normal healthy process/cycle being treated as an "inconvenience" gets my hackles up. So I'm half and half.

I guess it's like Viagra -- might be great for those with serious health problems, but not necessary for a 21 year old boy who can get it going on the hour, and certainly not worth the risk for him.

Just my opinion.

Shannon in CA

I thought I posted here already, but at the group, I don't see my
post, so I apologize if this is a repeat. You know my story, here's
what's new.
Here's the deal: The pharmacy was out of this yesterday, and had to
get more in. The script is filled today. I just picked it up.
I am currently on, and will be till I figure out how to do this the
best way for me .1 mcg of synthroid - 100 mcg.
The script is for 3gr. (180 mg) Thyroid USP (6060 and a V on off-
white pill) - which I guess is the generic of natural thyroid -
Armour?
I also think, from conversion charts I have read, that an equivalent
of 75 mcg of Synthroid is 1 gr./60 mg of Armour. And that a 1 1/4 or
1 1/3 gr is really equivalent to 100 mcg of synthroid.
I feel with a TSH of 1.66, and Free T4 of 1.4 on .8-1.8 scale, Free
T3 of 267 on 230-420 scale, that I was probably slightly
undertreated - which means I probably would have faired better with
112 or 125, but who knows.
Now, I know I can split these pills in two - no problem. I'll
probably split the sythroid in half and these in 1/4 for starting and
take 1/2 synthroid and 1/4 of a 3gr which would be like .75 gr.
My questions are:
Does this seem about right? And, yes, I know, it seems many who were
on 100 mcg synthroid converted higher to as much as 3 or 4 gr.
ALSO
Do ya'll find the Thyroid USP (generic?) has the same efficacy
(effectiveness) of Naturethroid, Armour, Westhroid?
Thanks for your assistance.
SuzyQ

Awesome, Bee, thaks for sharing.

Pamela
Bee Fuddled <beefuddled912@...

It is from numberless diverse acts of courage

and belief that human history is shaped.

Each time a man stands up for an ideal, or acts to improve

the lot of others, or strikes out against injustice,

he sends forth a tiny ripple of hope, and crossing each other

from a million different centers of energy and daring,

those ripples build a current that can sweep down

the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance.

~~ Robert F. Kennedy ~~

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
-:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

http://www.invisibledisabilities.com/niciaw.htm
PRESS RELEASE: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
CONTACT: The Invisible Disabilities Advocate, Sponsor
www.InvisibleDisabilities.com
ida@...
Rest Ministries, Official Sponsor
Ms. Lisa Copen, founder & director of Rest Ministries
858-486-4685 · toll-free 888-751-REST (7378)
web site: www.invisibleillness.com email: rest@...
Colorado (July 2003) More than 1 in 3 Americans has a chronic
condition, and despite what we may assume, 60% of those who live with
daily illness or pain are between the ages of 18 and 64. The majority
of chronic illness is invisible, including the xx people who
currently live with cancer and the millions who suffer the side
effects of cancer treatment.
September 22-28, 2003 is National Invisible Chronic Illness Awareness
Week. The theme is "But You Look So Good!" It is a major public
awareness campaign sponsored by Rest Ministries, an organization that
offers support environment for those who live with chronic illness or
pain.
"Living with an illness that is invisible to those around us can
often have a more devastating affect on our emotional health than the
physical pain," explains Lisa Copen, 33, founder of Rest Ministries
who lives with rheumatoid arthritis and fibromyalgia. "Friends and
family of those with chronic illness care a great deal about what
their loved ones are going through, but oftentimes the invisibility
of the illness sets up an environment for misunderstandings and even
doubt about the validity of the illness. We hope to increase
awareness of how many people 'look great' but are hurting deeply."
Local resident of Colorado, Wayne Connell (35), whose wife lives with
Multiple Sclerosis and Chronic-Late Lyme Disease says,
I would like to bring your attention to The National Invisible
Chronic Illness Awareness Week coming up on September 22-28! My wife,
Sherri, and I are the authors of the booklet, But You LOOK Good: A
Guide to Understanding and Encouraging People with Chronic Illness
and Pain!
Sherri became disabled with Multiple Sclerosis and Chronic Late Lyme
Disease in 1991. She has two Business Degrees and a minor in Liberal
Arts. She used to sing and dance in musicals, was a model and enjoyed
her career as a bookkeeping manager. Unfortunately, just as she was
beginning her Master's in Human Resource, she became paralyzed and
seriously ill. Since 1991, she has regained some of the use of her
legs, but she is still debilitated by unbearable fatigue, pain,
dizziness and cognitive dysfunction. Read more about Sherri's Story:
www.InvisibleDisabilities.com/story.htm
Through her experiences and those around her, Sherri has discovered
how difficult it is to live with a debilitating illness. Not only has
she lost her career, she has also struggles with the
misunderstandings of others. You see, when to those around, you "look
good" people have a tough time understanding that you actually "feel
horrible." Because of this, I founded the website, The Invisible
Disabilities Advocate: www.InvisibleDisabilities.com
The site offers articles, booklets, links, a support board and much
more! It is not for profit, as we put money from our own pockets into
this site. Read more about What & Who is IDA:
www.InvisibleDisabilities.com/ida.htm
What has been amazing to witness are all of the lives this site has
touched! We reach over 4,500 people a month. People who have lost
jobs, hobbies, friends and even spouses, due to their illness! Here
is what Tammy had to say about the site, "I sit here with tears in my
eyes, because I finally found a website that says what I have been
trying to say for years!! You have literally saved my life!" .....
Tammy, Ohio
Here is how the booklet helped Sue, "Terrific insights and
communicated clearly...my husband said it finally opened his eyes to
what I had been trying to say all these years. Thanks." ..... Sue,
New Jersey. Read what other sufferers, Physicians and Authors are
saying about IDA: www.InvisibleDisabilities.com/comments.htm
I am not trying to "toot my own horn!" I am just so excited to get
the information out that can help millions of hurting people! Please
consider informing your readers about The National Invisible Chronic
Illness Awareness Week and The Invisible Disabilities Advocate!
Outreach includes various events: the distribution of literature,
When a Friend Has a Chronic Illness: What to Say, How to Help.
Resources include But You Look So Good: A Guide to Understanding and
Encouraging People With Chronic Illness and Pain. Churches across the
U.S. will be participating by having various testimonies shared about
living with illness. Bumper stickers and other promotional items are
available. Special chat guests will be online and For a complete list
of events and resources visit www.invisibleillness.com or call 888-
751-7378. "The feeling of knowing that one's illness and pain is
acknowledged can have a great impact on how a person copes with
living with illness," says Copen. "We hope that by recognizing people
with illness rarely feel as good as they look, they will begin to
feel better understood, leading them to a more invigorating life

It is from numberless diverse acts of courage

and belief that human history is shaped.

Each time a man stands up for an ideal, or acts to improve

the lot of others, or strikes out against injustice,

he sends forth a tiny ripple of hope, and crossing each other

from a million different centers of energy and daring,

those ripples build a current that can sweep down

the mightiest walls of oppression and resistance.

~~ Robert F. Kennedy ~~

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
-:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

Although this is found mostly in people of African American heritage,
it DOES strike Caucasions with a background including trauma,
chemical exposure, parathyroid tumors at a young age (under 60 yrs.
old), etc.
The one view of the hip looks a LOT like my right one....almost all
the other calcinosis are on internal organs in me---especially my
left kidney and the adrenal there.
http://brighamrad.harvard.edu/Cases/bwh/hcache/166/full.html
Pam

Hi,
I am not sure if anyone else already replied or not, but the free t4
is low...should be in the upper 1/2 of the range and the tsh is too
high...should be down around 1.0 or maybe even less...
The other tests really don't matter and are obsolete...make sure
when you have tests to always ask for FREE t3 & FREE t4...it's an
automatic that they will do the tsh and probably come other useless
tests, but insist on these...
Welcome to the group...there are a lot of good people here...Hugs,
Bee

Hi Suzy, I think the 60mg Armour is OK. I'll try and explain.
Synthroid is 0.1 microgram. that equals 100mg of T4 only. Armour
(my understanding cause we don't have that brand here) comes in
combinations of T4 and T3. The combination is not exactly like the
combo in the human body. I think there is more T3. That should make
up the difference due to conversion.
Now 1 grain is equal to 60mg. Grains are the old apothocary way of
weighing and mg is the metric.
Hope this helps a little.
Cheers
Freda/Canada

I would like to see your lab results (along with their respecitive lab ranges) for your TSH, FT4, and FT3. This can also signal an adrenal problem.

Pam
texasnana52003 <texasnana52003@...

I have been advised in several places that this might be a symptom of thryroid problems or diabetes. I have been lowcarbing and have diabetes under control
Have not been able to get thyroid diagnosis as my blood work is withing acceptable limits. My temperature runs consistantly below 97 degrees. I lose very slow even when being very strict on lowcarb. Never lost on WW etc.
I sweat under stomach folds when exercising but no where else. Face gets red and heart rate stays up at a good rate during the total 45min. I weigh 232#.
I searched your archives but couldn't find anything.
Any advise is appreciated.
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:

Ya'll may remember that my doc 2 months ago wasn't too keen about hearing
about T3 supplementation. And, that I went to my gyn, who did Free T4 and Free
T3 - and even though my TSH in July was 1.66, and my Free T3 was 267 in 230-420
range - he sent me to a pharmacist who can hook me up with saliva testing of
adrenals and thyroid. I told him after consulting with the pharmacist that
I'd like to try Armour for a month or two, and then if I still don't feel well,
do the adrenal/thyroid saliva tests.
Wel, Gyn doc (according to nurse) ordered the saliva testing as suggested by
the pharmacist, but said no change in script at this time (which leads me to
believe he may not change at all, I just don't know, right?) How many tests
that turn up 'normal' do I have to go through before I could get him to script
Armour?
Anyway, I haven't picked up the test yet, and had considered traveling to
Chicago or ordering my own Armour on-line - when last ditch effort, I thought -
Why don't I talk to my doc's nurse (pcp, not gyn) and say, hey, he said 'quit
taking it' and I thought, 'yuh, right' but then gave it some thought, did some
research and would like to try a switch.
Well, today, I had to talk to Nurse PCP cause of my husband's meds, and so
when we were finished with that, said 'hey, and stated the above about my July
appt and what the doc said - and finished with, "I've been on synthroid for 2.5
years, and some days are good, some are bad, but I don't really feel it's
doing it for it, I'd like to try something else. Is that possible?" and she
said "Sure, I think he'll do that." and I said "REALLY!?" and she said, yes,
what
do you want to try, and I said "Armour thyroid" and she paused a moment to
write it down and asked me which pharmacy to call it into and said she would
talk to him and call me back.
I waited an hour or so, busy day, so I wasn't waiting too close to the edge
of my seat - when she called back and said, <ladies and gentlemen, drumroll
please
"Yes, he approved that and I will (or did) call it in to your pharmacy"
!!!!!! -- and I asked what dose, and she said "I just told them you were taking
.1
mcg of synthroid and to script equivalent dose, and that should be fine and
there are so so many refills (I think she said 5)" and I'm thinking 'oh, crap,
one grain of Armour is like .075 mcg of synthroid, and it won't be enough and
from what I have heard people who switched take a lot more Armour than they
did synthroid' - But, I said 'well, yeah, it would seem simple, but the exchange
is kind of funky' - and so I just let her go - cause I figure I can discuss
with the pharamcist who can call the doc back if necessary - OR - I just got 90
days of .1 mcg synthroid - and I know I want to switch over slowly, so, it's
no big whoop dog, I'll figure it out.
Now, I can't believe this doc who didn't want to hear about the BMJ article,
and said that he had patients who went to Endos and didn't come back on T3 and
now I'm wondering, did he think I meant T3 only? I don't know - that was in
July, when I feeling the dizzies bad and he said it might be an viral ear
infection and prescribed dizzy meds (which I never filled) and said I could try
decongestants first to see if that helped. I just never thought to ask him
outright if I could try another thyroid med! I mean Who woulda thunk?
So, I goes to the pharmacy, see, after work - and the script isn't ready
because 'they were out of it, should be in tomorrow', and I'm thinking what is
it
- and so I asked if it was 1 grain, or what - and the girl says ' 3 grains'.
I couldn't believe it! Since when is that an equivalent dose? That isn't
what Armour suggests is it? I mean, where did they pull that figure from?
Anyway, it's not like I'm going to complain and say "No, I don't think that's
right" - I know I can always buy a pill cutter.
Anyway, that reminds me of last week when I checked the Walgreens/WPI or is
that WHI - meds by mail, and they have Armour on the formulary now - but also
stated 15 mg, 240 mg and 300 mg. What? They don't even make 240 or 300, do
they? I checked out the Armour site and saw 15, 30, (did they have 45?) 60, 90,
120 and 180. So, I don't know about that!
Anyway, now I don't know if I should blow off the saliva testing - and how do
I explain to my gyn that I'm switching meds with a phone call? Regardless, I
wonder if I need to find a new doc who will know how to read blood tests. I
don't know, anyway, it's all good, right?
I was reading on Mary Shomon's site today about what the Shames suggested as
far as vitamins and supplements - and noticed that they thought about 10-20%
fall into the needing iodine category, but for the others it would just be
worse. The max formula One A Day has iodine. And, I wonder if I have been
feeling so good because of that - because they said if you don't eat a lot of
fish
and seafood or sea veggies and don't do a lot of salt (and maybe something
else) - you may need it. Well, the only thing I do eat my fair share of salt,
but
I wonder now if it still wasn't enough, as if I was iodine deficient. Or
maybe it was selenium, or zinc, or the calcium.
Or is it that fresh garlic I've been cooking with, or those really greasy
potatoes - or the onions I practically want to eat raw, or I don't know, maybe
that I'm doing something to get better - sick and tired of being sick and tired.
I feel for everyone who has it worse than I do/did.
And, even while I don't have as much fatigue, I am still kind of weak, and
still have to guage my activity accordingly. Also, my ears are ringing so
loudly - and that numbness/tingling in my feet is noticable more often. And, I
was
kind of stiff this morning when I woke up - eek. I wish I knew what the ear
ringing was from. Like, I have my energy back to a degree now, and have to
expend it on figuring out the ringing ears - I want cure, prevention - what can
I say? I hope after starting Armour my periods lessen in severity a bit,
along with the cramps and aches. :)
I'm still wondering if I do enough and do the right things if I could get off
of these thyroid meds, if it's possible. The idea of taking something 'the
rest of your life' ugh!
So, I've rambled enough. Keep your chin up, keep trying, don't give up You
never know unless you ask, I guess, is my lesson of the day - or maybe you
just have to take the right attitude and proper path?
SuzyQ

I have been advised in several places that this might be a symptom of thryroid
problems or diabetes. I have been lowcarbing and have diabetes under control
Have not been able to get thyroid diagnosis as my blood work is withing
acceptable limits. My temperature runs consistantly below 97 degrees. I lose
very slow even when being very strict on lowcarb. Never lost on WW etc.
I sweat under stomach folds when exercising but no where else. Face gets red and
heart rate stays up at a good rate during the total 45min. I weigh 232#.
I searched your archives but couldn't find anything.
Any advise is appreciated.

Whew....but....I WAS doing ALL of those things.....when I weighed 230 lbs.!! You're right---it just wouldn't work for everybody. Actually, my rheumy told me to avoid certain proteins, not limit my protein.....I was concerned about my diet, but he said my kidneys look fine, and I don't lean towards gout, and to keep doing what I was doing at this point.

Some people with RA are upset by foods that contain purine, and for those folks, they need to really watch their protein intake.

Pam
Matt and Linda Williams <mnlinc@...

I got this post today, thought some of us might like the info. Remember that what works for one person might not be the right thing for another. Best to gather as much info and make you own decisions. Hope everyone is feeling good and happy today! ~ Linda

Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 03:43 AM
Subject: Good Morning From Dr. Weil -- Managing Rheumatoid Arthritis Naturally

09.08.2003
Tip: Managing Rheumatoid Arthritis Naturally
Rheumatoid Arthritis (RA) is one of the most common autoimmune disorders - a disease caused by the immune system attacking the body's own tissues. This can be due to an infection, tissue injury or emotional trauma in people with a genetic predisposition. While conventional medicine treats RA with steroids and other immunosuppressive medications, natural treatments and lifestyle changes are less toxic and may moderate autoimmunity and control the symptoms of RA.
Try the following natural methods and see if they help to alleviate pain associated with RA or other autoimmune disorders:
* Decrease your protein intake to 10 percent of your daily calories.
* Replace animal protein as much as possible with plant protein.
* Eliminate milk and milk products, substituting other calcium sources.
* Eat organically-grown fruits and vegetables as much as possible as well as organic products made from wheat and soy.
* Eliminate polyunsaturated vegetable oils, margarine, vegetable shortening, all partially hydrogenated oils and all foods (such as deep-fried foods) that might contain trans-fatty acids. Use extra-virgin olive oil as your main fat.
* Increase your intake of omega-3 fatty acids.
* Eat more fruits and vegetables, especially organic varieties.
* Eat ginger and turmeric regularly.

The Right Time for Vitamin Time
What time should you take your vitamins? It's a good question, one whose answer depends upon the vitamin, but generally it is recommended to take vitamins with a meal containing fat, such as breakfast or supper. This allows for better absorption and less irritation to the stomach. For specific recommendations based on your personal information, take the Vitamin Advisor.

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I wouldn't use it, because I think having a period every month is one of the signs that can signal when everything is ok and not having one, lets me know to see why not...Bee
Matt and Linda Williams <mnlinc@...

Wondering what everyone's opinion of this is.

On the Endometriosis side, wondering if no menstruation would reduce the occurrance of Endometriosis.

On an physical side...isn't it rather unnatural to pop ourselves full of hormones just so we don't deal with cramping and blood? Would this totally prevent ovulation too?

Boy, it sure would be nice to NOT deal with these 30 day long periods every 2 to 4 weeks. And for those of us who get migraines with our cycle, like clockwork, would this drug take that issue away? I see these 2 things as benefits to taking this pill.

But something inside of me feel ill when I think of women pumping themselves up with yet more hormones. How many more generations will be screwed up by the chemicals us forefathers/mothers pumped into us to tollerate our lives easier?

Any other opinions? ~ Linda

New Pill Stops Women's Periods

FDA OKs Birth Control Pill That Reduces Number Of Monthly Menstrual Cycles
Sep 5, 2003 8:57 pm US/Central
WASHINGTON (CBS) Birth control pills helped spawn a social and sexual revolution when they first became widely available in the 1960s. And the latest version of the pill, approved by the Food and Drug Administration Friday, could start a whole new revolution.
For millions of women, the new pill will mean freedom from that monthly menace: the menstrual cycle, reports CBS News Correspondent Elizabeth Kaledin.
Unlike traditional birth control pills which create an artificial period every 28 days, women taking the new Seasonale stay on the drug for 84 days at a stretch.
The pills aren't a new chemical. They contain the same combination of low-dose estrogen and progestin found in many oral contraceptives.
Nor is the idea of menstrual suppression new. For decades, many doctors have told women how they can skip a period by continually taking the active birth-control pills in each month's supply and ignoring the week of dummy pills in each packet.
But Seasonale promises to make the option a little more convenient, with packaging that gives women 12 straight weeks of active pills and then a week of dummy pills for their period. And the FDA's approval means menstrual suppression could become more common, as Seasonale's advertising alerts women to the option.
"Any patient for whom the birth control pill is a reasonable option is a candidate for the new extended use cycle," says Dr. Shari Brasner.
To develop the drug, manufacturers polled women and literally asked them how many periods a year would be acceptable.
The answer: not very many.
In fact, two-thirds of women said four would be plenty.
"It turns out this normal, natural process known as menstruation seems not to fit into to the modern woman's life," says Brasner. "I think this is a new and very exciting way for women who are traveling, women who are really juggling quite a bit to take back a little control."
Angela Fontaine, 29, participated in trials of the drug. A full-time nurse, mom and outdoorswoman, her periods not only gave her cramps, they cramped her style.
"It's just an inconvenience," she says. "It's just nice to not have to worry about it."
She plans to take the drug for good, while others like Barbara Alexander find the whole idea unnerving.
"It seems a little unnatural," Alexander says.
And neither is Seasonale without its drawbacks, the FDA cautioned.
While women have fewer scheduled periods, studies show Seasonale users have about twice the risk of unexpected "breakthrough" bleeding between periods as woman taking conventional monthly cycle pills, especially in the first few cycles of use. Also, 7.7 percent of Seasonale users dropped out of studies of the drug citing unacceptable bleeding, compared with 1.8 percent of women taking conventional monthly pills. Some Seasonale users had so much breakthrough bleeding that their total days of bleeding over a year were no less with the new drug than with regular pills, FDA said.
So the agency ordered that Seasonale's label state that women must weigh that inconvenience against fewer regular periods.
"Each woman will respond to this product somewhat differently," said FDA's Dr. Scott Monroe. "Some will find they respond entirely as the product was designed to function, and others will have increased intermenstrual bleeding to the extent that they choose not to continue with the product."
Maker Barr Laboratories plans to have prescription-only Seasonale in pharmacies by November. Barr wouldn't reveal Seasonale's price but said it will be comparable to other brand-name oral contraceptives, which sell for roughly $1 a pill. Generic versions can cost half that amount.
Having fewer periods "was absolutely fabulous," said Shannon Zaichenko, 27, of Chesapeake, Va., who spent three years in a study of Seasonale.
"It's the convenience, not being bogged down, not having to plan vacations or just lifestyle around seven days of bleeding," she said. A frequent traveler, Zaichenko recalled that before Seasonale her periods "always seemed to happen when I was on a plane for 20 hours."
Seasonale also may be attractive to women who experience severe cramping, heavy bleeding and other menstrual-related symptoms, a number Barr estimates at 2.5 million in the United States.
But the National Women's Health Network says some Seasonale proponents falsely imply that limiting menstruation is generally healthier, a message the consumer group calls particularly unwise for young girls.
"We already have a lot of shame and stigma in this society about menstruation," cautions the network's Cynthia Pearson, who has asked Barr to ensure that Seasonale ads don't convey that impression.
During the menstrual cycle, fluctuations in estrogen signal the uterine lining, or endometrium, to thicken in preparation for nourishing an embryo. If pregnancy doesn't occur, that excess lining is sloughed off, accompanied by bleeding.
The big safety question is whether four periods a year are enough to allow the uterus to shed any tissue that builds up.
A study by Eastern Virginia Medical School, which developed the three-month pill regimen, shows they are. It tracked 682 women taking either Seasonale or regular monthly pills for a year. Seasonale proved equally effective at preventing pregnancy. Side effects, too, were similar with the exception of breakthrough bleeding, which did decrease with each cycle of Seasonale use.
"There is no concern in delaying the period for three months," says Dr. Vanessa Cullins of Planned Parenthood.
In fact, she notes, women today have far more periods in their lifetime than their ancestors before the era of contraception, when women spent much more time either pregnant or breast-feeding, both of which block menstruation.
Not every woman will be comfortable with Seasonale, Cullins said monthly bleeding gives some contraceptive users added reassurance that they're not pregnant.
(© 2003 CBS Worldwide Inc. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten, or redistributed. The Associated Press contributed to this report. )

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
-:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

I was on both at the same time and had no problems. I was on 20 mg. The only thing I think you should know, in case they didn't tell you, is it can make you very tired so I always took mine at bedtime. It helped a lot with social anxiety and depression.

Angie

Hi group thanx for letting me be apart of your support group.Just
like the rest of you I do have thyroid problems.13 years ago I was
dignose with graves disease,I had it for three years and got rid of
it,but I an still taking my medication for it to keep me alive
without my medication I would be here.If there is anything I can help
with please feel free to write me and we can talk.
your friend,
Stacy

Hi,

What is in the patch you take? how much does it cost?

Pam
thinin02 <ew1409@...

Hi all. Pam S., I know you mentioned certain supplements that you
take. Are CoQ10 and L-Carnetine appropriate for hypos?I'm looking at
the Atkins recommendations for slow losers.I also got a catalog from
the nutrition website you mentioned a while back. What do you get
from them?
Thanks!!
Elaine (PS, just started the estradiol patch today.They wound up
subbing the esclim for the Vivelle with my Doc's permission. Just
means it's a bigger patch, meds are the same and it's cheaper to me)

Hi all. Pam S., I know you mentioned certain supplements that you
take. Are CoQ10 and L-Carnetine appropriate for hypos?I'm looking at
the Atkins recommendations for slow losers.I also got a catalog from
the nutrition website you mentioned a while back. What do you get
from them?
Thanks!!
Elaine (PS, just started the estradiol patch today.They wound up
subbing the esclim for the Vivelle with my Doc's permission. Just
means it's a bigger patch, meds are the same and it's cheaper to me)

Here's a really informative page on kinesiology:

http://www.kinesiology.com.au/

I got this post today, thought some of us might like the info. Remember that what works for one person might not be the right thing for another. Best to gather as much info and make you own decisions. Hope everyone is feeling good and happy today! ~ Linda

Sent: Monday, September 08, 2003 03:43 AM
Subject: Good Morning From Dr. Weil -- Managing Rheumatoid Arthritis Naturally

[INLINE]

09.08.2003
Tip: Managing Rheumatoid Arthritis Naturally
Rheumatoid Arthritis (RA) is one of the most common autoimmune disorders - a disease caused by the immune system attacking the body's own tissues. This can be due to an infection, tissue injury or emotional trauma in people with a genetic predisposition. While conventional medicine treats RA with steroids and other immunosuppressive medications, natural treatments and lifestyle changes are less toxic and may moderate autoimmunity and control the symptoms of RA.
Try the following natural methods and see if they help to alleviate pain associated with RA or other autoimmune disorders:
* Decrease your protein intake to 10 percent of your daily calories.
* Replace animal protein as much as possible with plant protein.
* Eliminate milk and milk products, substituting other calcium sources.
* Eat organically-grown fruits and vegetables as much as possible as well as organic products made from wheat and soy.
* Eliminate polyunsaturated vegetable oils, margarine, vegetable shortening, all partially hydrogenated oils and all foods (such as deep-fried foods) that might contain trans-fatty acids. Use extra-virgin olive oil as your main fat.
* Increase your intake of omega-3 fatty acids.
* Eat more fruits and vegetables, especially organic varieties.
* Eat ginger and turmeric regularly.

The Right Time for Vitamin Time
What time should you take your vitamins? It's a good question, one whose answer depends upon the vitamin, but generally it is recommended to take vitamins with a meal containing fat, such as breakfast or supper. This allows for better absorption and less irritation to the stomach. For specific recommendations based on your personal information, take the Vitamin Advisor.

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Angie,
Yes, I have a lot of dizziness. I get lightheaded out of nowhere,
like these dizzy spells, is that how you feel?
I had breast milk before when I was hypo, but I was also recently off
Prozac (undiagnosed hypo made doctors give me tons of
antidepressants) and the doctor told me it was a fairly common
problem in the first few months after stopping it. A month later it
was gone, so I never had the prolactin tested.

I'm not sure if I have asked this before.But I am wondering what kind of reaction does paxil have when taking synthroid if any?

Thanks...Phil

I also have breast milk. My prolactin levels were normal. I had an MRI done to check for a tumor in my pituitary and it ended up being nothing. I seem to get breast milk every time I go hypo. Do you have any dizziness? That is the other symptom that I have.

Angie

Can someone please tell me what exactly these kind of people do? I found one that is only an hour away from me and I thought about going but I would like to know what to expect and what kinds of tests they do? Are they covered by any kind of insurance?

Angie

Too often we underestimate the power of a touch, a smile, a kind
word, a listening ear, an honest compliment, or the smallest act of
caring, all of which have the potential to turn a life around.
--Leo Buscaglia

Well, the parathyroid tumors I had 15 years ago made me ache so bad, and my hips hurt so that I was about doubled over---but hasten to add the usual age for these tumors are around 65 years plus!! They don't have anything to do with the thyroid. They control the calcium in the bloodstream---mine obviously did NOT do their job!!

It doesn't matter if I take Vitamin D or calcium----I have chemical damage which in turn with the malfunctioning parathyroids, makes it almost impossible for my bones to accept the vitamin D and the calcium. That is my problem. Plus being post meno at age 42...AND having had taken so much Prednisone for my asthma...it's all a bad thing now with the osteoporosis. BUT..I happen to have an inkling of how long I had Hashi's----14 years ago, after a bone scan (for the parathyroid problem), they had done a TSH---I found that record two years ago----my TSH was a 43---with a doc's note: Will check again next year.

At least the test for parathyroid problems is easy....just a blood calcium test is all it takes---I was being treated for possible arthritis all those years ago until they finally did a blood calcium. I'm starting to get nervous about going to the rheumy this Friday. Then next week I see a pulmonologist, and the endo again. Whew!! I haven't been to this many doctor's since I was little!!

Pam

Welcome, Freda. I am sort of new too, but I wanted to say hi.
You can lose the weight once the thyroid is working. It will still be
harder than for "normal" people, I am not gonna lie, but my weight
went from 115lb to 230lb and I managed to get down to 119lb. Of
course, when the symptoms return I gain 5-10lb overnight, which sucks
cause it takes months to lose, just a few days to gain, but I haven't
given up yet. And once the thyroid is under control, you will be less
achey and tired and will be able to actually exercise. Hang in
there. :)

Hi freda,

Welcome to the group. That Buddha belly just goes with thyroid territory,let me tell ya. I'm a lowcarber, as are several in the group here, and that's how I keep my size under control. I lost an initial 113 pounds and have kept that off for a couple of years, now I'm finding it extremely difficult to lift weights and cardio exercise---so I'm going to try Pilates under the suggestion of my rheumatologist.

I just got a DVD in the mail I ordered, and Bee has offered to burn Winsor pilates for me.....this should help to keep my flexibility. If I don't get back to you all tomorrow, then you know I've turned myself into a pretzel in my living room, lol. Welcome to you!!

Pam
freda189 <aaadowling@...

I just recieved your invitation to join this group. Thank you so
much.
I'll tell you all a little bit about myself:
Diagnosed 4 years ago, although, I believe I have been suffering much
longer than that. I have Hashimotos. My weight has balloned from
135LBS to 180LBS. Nothing seems to budge it. At least it has
stablized. I do have a treadmill, but, most of the time am too achey
and exausted to use it. Have tried every diet known to man and still
have a belly to rival buddha.
Hope I can at the least, lend a sympathetic ear and at the most, be
helpful to this group, in some small way.
Cheers
Freda/Canada
To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:

Hey, thanks for the info. I am wondering if adrenal fatigue is
contributing to my current issues. I am having some hypothyroidism
symptoms that overlap with what I read about the adrenals. But I am
also having some dull pain on my back where the kidneys are but only
on my right side. Do you know if adrenal fatigue can cause pain? I
have an appointment with my endo, but not until Septmeber 16th.
Thanks, again, for your help.

I know this message was directed to Pam, but, could I jump in? If
you have osteoporosis, it can cause pain. In fact, it is very
painful. Bone builders are on the market and they can help you
regain the bone you have lost. There are 2 drawbacks. You need to
inject them. Much like insulin, the stomachs acids destroy the
active ingredient if taken orally. And second, they are expensive.
Also, get your adrenals checked. Sometimes hashis patients wind up
with adrenal fatigue if undiagnosed.
Cheers
Freda/Canada

Hi Pam, I'm new here and just read your message. You can count me
in. I can either email or snail mail or both. Care packages are my
speciality. I have family in the service, so I know how important
this is.
Cheers
Freda/Canada

Hi everyone. It is only my second time posting here, so I guess an
introduction is in order. I am 28, and have had Hashimoto's for
almost 8 years, medicated for the last 2 of them only.
I used to be treated by a GP, but moved cities and had to find a new
doctor. I hate endos with a passion, so I went to a gyn-ob instead. I
loved her; she is very updated about thyroid treatment. She looked at
all my old tests and instead of showing concern for one where my TSH
was 1.5, at which time I felt the best, she said "That is the range
we should be shooting for". My GP said when she saw the same exam "We
have to lower your meds, you are going hyperthyroid", so that is a
great sign. I told her I've been feeling all the symptoms for a
couple months now, and 3 weeks ago I started bloating and gained 7lb
overnight literally (from Monday to Wednesday of the same week) and I
got that heavy leg feeling you all must be familiar with. And I also
seem to be having fybromialgia, which I never had before.
So she ordered all the usual tests (TSH, free T3 and T4, antibodies,
full blood panel + cholesterol) plus testosterone and prolactin.
During the exam, she found some breast milk. I am not and have never
been pregnant, so she was concerned. She didn't wanna tell me what
she suspects is wrong with me to order these tests, but I am vaguely
scared. I know a bit about hypothyroidism now, so I am not afraid of
it anymore, and imagining I might have a new disorder I know nothing
about is frightnening. So I guess the point of my long rambling post
is: did any of you have these tests done, testosterone and prolactin?
The only thing I can think of is PCOS, is there anything else that
might require these tests?
Thanks in advance.

International Council for Control of Iodine Deficiency Disorders - non-profit, non-government organization for the sustainable elimination of iodine deficiency and the promotion of optimal iodine nutrition worldwide.
http://www.people.virginia.edu/~jtd/iccidd/

Iodine - non-metallic trace element required for the synthesis of thyroid hormones. Includes causes and symptoms of deficiency and nutrient interactions.
http://www.orst.edu/dept/lpi/infocenter/minerals/iodine/

MEDLINEplus: Iodine in diet - mineral necessary for the normal metabolism of cells, the production of thyroid hormones, and normal thyroid function. Includes recommendations and side effects.
http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/ency/article/002421.htm

Iodine and Health - includes benefits, minimum dosage, and adverse reactions.
http://www.healthhelper.com/vitamins/minerals/iodine.htm

Iodine - chic prescriptions for bath, skin care, and de-stressing.
http://www.iodinebeauty.com/
This is an eye opener extremely interesting to read~~IODINE
http://bodywise.com/products/ingredients/iodine.htm

Iodine Deficiency Current Situation & Future Prospects http://www.endolinx.com/thearts.cfm?artid=330536&specid=16&ok=yes

http://www.epinions.com/content_23479815812 ...read warnings to over-dose

Avoid excess iodine. Stick with the RDA of 150 micrograms (mcg.) Many alternative practitioners believe giving iodine will help thyroid but elevated levels of iodine suppress thyroid function and may be a primary cause of auto-immune thyroiditis (Hashimoto's)<<<exerpt http://www.krispin.com/thyroid.html

Iodine and Health - includes benefits, minimum dosage, and adverse reactions. http://www.healthhelper.com/vitamins/minerals/iodine.htm

http://www.gnc.com/health_notes/Supp/Iodine.htm Iodine

http://www.benutsnews.com/cmrs_thyroid.htm THYROID DISORDERS

Search on Iodine at About.com Thyroid http://thyroid.about.com/sitesearch.htm?terms=iodine&SUName=thyroid&TopNode=3042&type=1

July THYROID CURE - Do it Yourself

http://www.behealthy.com/newslt00.html#THYROID%20CURE

If you have an under-active thyroid, it may be partly due to an iodine deficiency. Reason: your body needs more iodine in order to manufacture thyroxin, the thyroid hormone.
There is an excellent test you can do at home to check your iodine levels. Simply take a Cotton Swab, dip it into a 2% tincture of Iodine (available at drug stores) and paint a spot the size of a Silver Dollar on you thigh or leg. If it disappears in less than twenty-four hours, you would be low in iodine. However, if it last for twenty-four hours, you have sufficient iodine levels. If you are low in iodine, repeat this process daily until this spot last for twenty-four hours.

CLINICAL STUDY: Addition of microencapsulated iron to iodized salt improves the efficacy of iodine in goitrous, iron-deficient children: a randomized, double blind, controlled trial http://www.endolinx.com/thearts.cfm?artid=449232&specid=16&ok=yes Michael B Zimmermann, Christophe Zeder, Nourredine Chaouki^1, Toni Torresani^2, Amina Saad^1 and Richard F Hurrell The Human Nutrition Laboratory, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology, Zürich, Switzerland, ^1 The Ministry of Health, Rabat, Morocco and ^2 The Department of Endocrinology, University of Zürich Childrens Hospital, Zürich, Switzerland (Correspondence should be addressed to Michael Zimmermann, Laboratory for Human Nutrition, Swiss Federal Institute of Technology, Seestrasse 72 / PO Box 474, CH-8803 Rüschlikon, Switzerland)

Abstract

Objective: in many developing countries, children are at high risk for both goiter and anemia. iron (Fe) deficiency adversely effects thyroid metabolism and reduces efficacy of iodine prophylaxis in areas of endemic goiter. the study aim was to determine if co-fortification of iodized salt with fe would improve efficacy of the iodine in goitrous children with a high prevalence of anemia.

Design and methods: In a 9-month, randomized, double-blind trial, 6-15 yr-old children (n=377) were given iodized salt (25 mg iodine/g salt) or dual-fortified salt with iodine (25 mg iodine/g salt) and Fe (1 mg Fe/g salt, as ferrous sulfate microencapsulated with partially hydrogenated vegetable oil).

Results: In the dual-fortified salt group, hemoglobin and Fe status improved significantly compared with the iodized salt group (P<0.05). At 40 weeks, the mean decrease in thyroid volume measured by ultrasound in the dual-fortified salt group (38%) was twice that of the iodized salt group (18%) (P<0.01). Compared with the iodized salt group, serum thyroxine was significantly increased (P<0.05) and the prevalence of hypothyroidism and goiter decreased (P<0.01) in the dual- fortified salt group.

Conclusion: Addition of encapsulated Fe to iodized salt improves the efficacy of iodine in goitrous children with a high prevalence of anemia.

European Journal of Endocrinology

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
-:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

Dear Bee,
I know I don't post often, not much to say as much of this is new to
me (less than 6 months of knowing about thryoid and even less of
knowing about Hashi's disease).
But I do want you and the others who post here to know how very much
I appreciate what you send. Rarely does a day go by when I don't
read the posts, I get them in the "bunched" format which keeps it
all together, but at times makes it more awkward to respond.
Although not all articles apply, Bee your posts are always extensive
and scholarly with credible sources as opposed to just someone's
individual experience. Please understand, I enjoy reading the
personal experiences, but my physician listens to the credible
sources :-)
As I learn more and feel confident in expressing what I have found
to be true, I'll contribute more, but for now just know some of
the "lurkers," wouldn't be as far along with their diagnosis and
treatment if it were not for you and this site!
Thanks again to you Bee and to all of you who contribute.
Katiesee
PS The humor found on this site is too fun! I especially enjoyed
wondering about pig beauty and the coffee brewing is being passed on
to my spouse!

<< I know four people with adrenal, as well as, thyroid problems. All four
are thin as rails!! I have an adrenal problem, though not their type.
SQ: Are their thryoid problems hypo or hyper? Do they have adrenal
insufficiency?
SuzyQ

<< As I look back from where I am now (along with the Sjogrens and the
Hashimoto's that was un dx'ed for soooo long, and untreated, I now have
osteoporosis, RA, and am going to find out for sure this coming Friday (I hope,
maybe more
tests) what else. I had been treated for the following: arthritis (with
NSAIDS which I can no longer take,,,surgery would have helped more), stones in
salivary glands (couldnt' they figure out WHY my bones were getting brittle and
that the calcium was even in my blood and heart??), depression (Zoloft for five
days-----all I could take)
SQ: Pam, how long do you think you went undiagnosed, and then, how long were
you undertreated?
My concern at this point is the connection between the thyroid and
parathyroid - as the parathyroid, from what I understand, is responsible for
calcitonin
- which is a hormone(?) - whatever it is I believe it is responsible for
halting or decreasing bone (calcium) reabsorption. Now, I wonder if the aches
and
pains many have in their bones or the feeling of arthritis, even when on
replacement hormone (usually synthroid) - obtaining that TSH suppression - and
replacement of only ONE of the KNOWN hormones the thryoid produces - BUT, does
it
affect the production of the parathyroid - calcitonin - by decreasing it's
production due to TSH level - and/or also, if the thyroid is compromised (as in
producing less) and therefore one needs hormone supplementation if not total
replacement - shouldn't EVERY thyroid hormone be replaced/supplemented equally
as the body would naturally produce it?
This seems to be an obvious connectoin for me, when I hear of joint pain and
stiffness, arthritic feelings - and women are just naturally more suseptible
to osteoporosis anyway.
I hope you are taking a calcium supplement and vit D. But, I wonder if you
may look into the calcitonin connection.
And,yes, I want to PREVENT further problems - which I understand just because
one is hypothyroid predisposes you naturally to other conditions - but the
way things are now, I wonder how many of these OTHER conditions are caused
STRICTLY by the use of T4 only supplementation. I also wonder about synthetic
hormones, even if they are bioidentical.
SuzyQ

I just recieved your invitation to join this group. Thank you so
much.
I'll tell you all a little bit about myself:
Diagnosed 4 years ago, although, I believe I have been suffering much
longer than that. I have Hashimotos. My weight has balloned from
135LBS to 180LBS. Nothing seems to budge it. At least it has
stablized. I do have a treadmill, but, most of the time am too achey
and exausted to use it. Have tried every diet known to man and still
have a belly to rival buddha.
Hope I can at the least, lend a sympathetic ear and at the most, be
helpful to this group, in some small way.
Cheers
Freda/Canada

Hi,
I have written an email to Ken asking him to send up emails and snail
mail addy's of some of the soldiers who need mail, hope you all don't
mind, I will post it as soon as I receive a reply. I also wanted to
say thank you to all that responded to Ken, in any way.
Pam
Another LC Day in Baghdad (update from Ken)
Hello evryone, I hope you are all doing great on your WOE, I am still
trying to guess my weight (since I dont have a scale) and the local
nationals dont have one they can sell me, how wrong is that?
I appriciate and live to respond to everyone who writes and sends
something to me down here, just the other day I received a care
package not just for myself but for some other people in my unit,
thanks so much.
Its started to cool off down here, I dont think it even broke 100
degrees today, My co-workers and I pitched in and bought the 1st
season of the sopranos on DVD, the only problem is we have seen all
the episodes and are eager to see seasons 2 and 3, is anyone willing
to part with their copies? probably not, but I didnt think it could
hurt to ask.
EAting LC down here is very interesting, the PX only has pork rinds,
peanuts and beef jerkey, so I have to be creative when it comes to
meals down here, I swear I was chasing a scorpion the other night,
was I going to eat it? I didnt know how many carbs it had.lol
Please keep the emails comming, you guys are great and I wish you all
good health and good luck with your WOE.
Kenneth.knapp@...
ken.

Joan, I second you COMPLETELY!!!!!

Bee, you have been the most valuable asset to have during my struggle with this disease! Between Bee, PyroPam and JEM, (as well as my other Thyroid Sisters and Brothers too) I have learned so much about what to expect with the disease, how it SHOULD be treated by my physician (even though most doc's are a total joke!) and ways that I can improve my life living with thryoid disease.

I was reading the PCOS posts, Bee has posted the same/similar article a few times but I always skim over it...I am SOOOOOOO glad you reposted this particular one as most of the symptoms I am really struggling with are on the PCOS list. I had a tubal when Brennan was born, recently we believed I was pregnant, now I am not so sure as I am not as sick every day - like with my other pregnancies, but my body is still acting completely weird!! Like JUST NOW!!! I just felt a HUGE kick down on my left side about 2-1/2 inches from my belly button. I don't know if these "kicks" could be ovary movement from cysts or if it is a baby!!!! I am terrified to go to the doctor as they will find either: 1.) That I truly AM pregnant, Dear God - what is your message in sending me another child...I BARELY make it through the day as it is! or 2.) I will look positively crazy because they will not bother to find out what is REALLY wrong with me! But reading articles like what Bee finds for
me, which always seems to be at JUST THE RIGHT TIME (!!!)...gives me the courage to seek answers to my health questions. I printed out 2 of the PCOS posts and will highlight my symptoms, present it to the docs as evidence that this could be what is wrong, and go from there. If I end up in the looney bin I will beg Matt to send you a post! (chuckles sadly)

Bee, if God had not sent you to find me, I don't know WHERE the hell I would be today, but I honestly don't think I would be alive...you have saved my life many times...I am crying now - because you mean so much, have done so much for me...a simple Thank You is such a small way to say how much gratitude I have for what you do for us all...but I know no other words to say.

Thank You for being my friend Bee!!! Even when I am not around much, know that you are appreciated and you enhance my life! :-) ~ Love always, Linda

Bee, thanks for posting this article, I got a lot of affirmation from it. I was finding everything that we discuss here at the site to be what they recommend, the different fat content foods often being fortified, how damaging the pop/soda that I drink is, and the recent conversation about the sun. This article pulled all of our topics into one...I am so glad you found it to validate our beliefs! ~ Linda

I did a search on my Delphi site on adrenals...Here is everything of relevance that popped up...they don't really compare thyroid/adrenal, but there is lots of good info...a lot of the messages were too long to print all out here so I put the link to the message instead of printing the whole article on the ones that weren't just a link...Bee
Dr. Berg's HealthySelf Tip of the Week ~~Is SALT really bad for you? http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=2312.5
Dr. Berg's HealthySelf Tip of the Week~~Getting a Good Night Sleep http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=2312.16
Adrenal Problems (Replacement cortisone therapy) By Dr Barry Durrant-Peatfield MB, BS, LRCP, MRCS
http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=1477.1
Cushings Disease/Autoimmune/Adrenals<<<This is the first message in a thread I started with search listing from a search on cushings...
http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=2355.1
The Adrenal - Thyroid Connection - Drs. Richard and Karilee Shames http://thyroid.about.com/health/thyroid/library/weekly/aa052801a.htm
Gail's Thyroid Tips - Adrenals http://home.usaa.net/~wurmstein/
Here is a site that has a chart of symptom comparison for thyroid and adrenal deficiencies: http://www.drrind.com/symptoms.asp
Here is a site that explains the safe use of Cortisol for adrenal supplementation: http://members.aol.com/jefferiesw/index.html
Overactive Adrenals Leads to Insomnia - Scientists have found that insomnia may be caused by stress-induced adrenal dysfunction. Could this mean doctors will have to change the way they treat insomniacs?
http://www.mercola.com/2001/aug/29/insomnia.htm
The book "Tired of Being Tired" by Jesse Lynn Hanley, M.D. gives a ten step program for rebuilding the adrenals.
1. eat whole foods as often as feel hunger. eat no more than you need to be satisfied. This stabilizes your blood sugar.
2. exercise a small amount. if you are in the "burned out" stage described in the book you cannot exercise much at this time--walking to the mailbox & back is probably plenty. you could also try yoga or lifting small weights at home.
3. calm your central nervous system with relaxing techniques.
4. pay off your sleep debt-make sure to get as much as YOU need. includes supplements that will help you sleep (though I just read that melatonin will depress the thyroid)
5. stop taking poisons-caffeine, sugar, stimulents & drugs
6. Supplements
7. Oxygenate-deep breathing technique
8. learn about hidden toxins (in food, water, personal care products, cleaning products)
9. have fun every day (no explanation necessary!)
10. cultivate self fulfillment -- what do you need to feel enriched--art, music, church, etc.

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
-:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

Bee I have just spent awhile reading the links you have posted on this Delphi site which I have not seen before.Thank you so much for all the work you do to help us all.I have admired you for a long time( I only got my p.c. last december} I think it is truly amazing that you do all this work to benefit others even though you your self are also ill.I live in England and with the help of your self Topper and Wendy I have never learned so much in the 30 yrs. I have had this disease.Thank you from the bottom of my heart.Love from Joanxx
Bee Fuddled <beefuddled912@...

I did a search on my Delphi site on adrenals...Here is everything of relevance that popped up...they don't really compare thyroid/adrenal, but there is lots of good info...a lot of the messages were too long to print all out here so I put the link to the message instead of printing the whole article on the ones that weren't just a link...Bee
Dr. Berg's HealthySelf Tip of the Week ~~Is SALT really bad for you? http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=2312.5
Dr. Berg's HealthySelf Tip of the Week~~Getting a Good Night Sleep http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=2312.16
Adrenal Problems (Replacement cortisone therapy) By Dr Barry Durrant-Peatfield MB, BS, LRCP, MRCS
http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=1477.1
Cushings Disease/Autoimmune/Adrenals<<<This is the first message in a thread I started with search listing from a search on cushings...
http://forums.delphiforums.com/thyroidfitness/messages?msg=2355.1
The Adrenal - Thyroid Connection - Drs. Richard and Karilee Shames http://thyroid.about.com/health/thyroid/library/weekly/aa052801a.htm
Gail's Thyroid Tips - Adrenals http://home.usaa.net/~wurmstein/
Here is a site that has a chart of symptom comparison for thyroid and adrenal deficiencies: http://www.drrind.com/symptoms.asp
Here is a site that explains the safe use of Cortisol for adrenal supplementation: http://members.aol.com/jefferiesw/index.html
Overactive Adrenals Leads to Insomnia - Scientists have found that insomnia may be caused by stress-induced adrenal dysfunction. Could this mean doctors will have to change the way they treat insomniacs?
http://www.mercola.com/2001/aug/29/insomnia.htm
The book "Tired of Being Tired" by Jesse Lynn Hanley, M.D. gives a ten step program for rebuilding the adrenals.
1. eat whole foods as often as feel hunger. eat no more than you need to be satisfied. This stabilizes your blood sugar.
2. exercise a small amount. if you are in the "burned out" stage described in the book you cannot exercise much at this time--walking to the mailbox & back is probably plenty. you could also try yoga or lifting small weights at home.
3. calm your central nervous system with relaxing techniques.
4. pay off your sleep debt-make sure to get as much as YOU need. includes supplements that will help you sleep (though I just read that melatonin will depress the thyroid)
5. stop taking poisons-caffeine, sugar, stimulents & drugs
6. Supplements
7. Oxygenate-deep breathing technique
8. learn about hidden toxins (in food, water, personal care products, cleaning products)
9. have fun every day (no explanation necessary!)
10. cultivate self fulfillment -- what do you need to feel enriched--art, music, church, etc.

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
-:¦:-
¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

WHA Health Flash #139: Polycystic Ovary Syndrome 6/29/02

Dear Friends:
Polycystic ovary syndrome (PCOS) is one of the leading causes of infertility in women and affects an estimated six to ten percent of women of childbearing age. As many as 30 percent of all women are believed to have some of the characteristics of the syndrome.
What are the signs and symptoms of PCOS?
Menstrual problems: Approximately 75 percent of those with this disorder experience this symptom. Periods can be infrequent, irregular, or absent completely. Cycles are often more than six weeks long, and many find that their menses are heavy when they do arrive. Menstrual disturbances are caused by problems with regular monthly ovulation (release of a mature egg follicle by an ovary).
Hyperandrogenism (increased levels of male hormones): This can cause excessive hair growth, acne or oily skin, and even male-pattern hair loss.
Infertility: Some women with PCOS ovulate normally and will not have problems in becoming pregnant due to PCOS. Others ovulate infrequently which can interfere with and delay their ability to become pregnant, while still others do not ovulate at all and will need medical treatment for their infertility.
Weight gain: Approximately 40 percent of females with PCOS are overweight. Most often a woman with PCOS will gain weight in the abdomen, while having thinner arms and legs, causing what is called an apple figure.
Cystic ovaries: Early research on PCOS focused on the characteristic string of pearls appearance of a PCOS ovary with numerous cysts (fluid-filled sacs). The presence of these cysts can increase the size of the ovary by 1.5 to 3 times normal size. However, recent studies have indicated that some women with characteristic signs and symptoms of PCOS have ovaries that are of normal size.
Insulin resistance and hyperinsulinemia: Insulin resistance occurs when the body is unable to efficiently use insulin. This often leads to hyperinsulinemia (an over-production of insulin) as the body tries to compensate. Often blood sugar levels will be normal, but these conditions may lead to diabetes.
Other symptoms may include: chronic pelvic pain (possibly caused by enlarged ovaries), abnormalities in cholesterol with LDL (elevated) and HDL (lowered), high triglycerides, hypertension (high blood pressure), formation of skin tags (tiny flaps of skin), and darker areas of skin usually found on the back of the neck, underarms, under the breasts, and in the groin.
What causes PCOS?
The exact cause of PCOS is currently unclear. There are several theories regarding the possible causes. One associates the development of PCOS with increased LH (luteinizing hormone). It is believed that the increase in LH promotes secretion of androgens (male hormones) from the ovaries. These androgens are believed to interfere with the development of mature egg follicles from the ovary, and disrupt estrogen production.
Another theory holds that hyperinsulinemia contributes to androgen production, obesity, and disruption of the menstrual cycle.
How is PCOS diagnosed?
There are other disorders that have symptoms similar to PCOS, and it is important to rule out these conditions so that proper diagnosis is made to prevent complications. Among the laboratory tests used to make a diagnosis is hormone level testing for DHEA-S, testosterone, androstenedione, and TSH, these can be performed easily and privately by taking a saliva sample in your own home using a testing kit from Women's Health America, Inc..
The doctor will also perform a history and physical exam, checking for the signs and symptoms of PCOS. An ultrasound is typically performed when PCOS is suspected; however, the finding of polycystic ovaries by ultrasound does not confirm a diagnosis of PCOS unless symptoms and/or laboratory results concur.
How is PCOS treated?
Appropriate treatment is based on symptoms and fertility status and can include:
Weight loss: Decreasing insulin levels through diet and exercise may promote regular menstrual cycles.
Oral contraceptives and progestins: These synthetic hormones can decrease LH (luteinizing hormone levels) and regulate the menstrual cycle. The oral contraceptive pill can also treat the symptoms of acne and excessive hair growth caused by high levels of androgens.
Anti-androgen medications: These aid in improving skin conditions, male-pattern baldness, and excessive hair growth. Any woman using these medications should be sure not to become pregnant as they are a risk to a developing fetus.
Gonadotropin-releasing hormone (GnRH) agonists: These medications are used to deplete the pituitary gland of FSH (follicle stimulating hormone) and LH. Side-effects produced by these medications are similar to the symptoms of menopause and include: bone loss, hot flashes, vaginal dryness, and decreased sexual drive/libido.
Fertility medication: This may be used to induce ovulation.
Surgery: Surgical treatment of the ovary is aimed at reducing LH and androgen production and establishing a normal menstrual cycle.
Insulin-sensitizing medications: Using medications to enhance the bodys sensitivity to insulin has shown promise in relieving the hormonal abnormalities of PCOS.
What are the long-term risks of PCOS?
It is important to remember that regular physician and laboratory monitoring and appropriate treatment can aid in preventing the development of these complications.
* Hypertension (high blood pressure)
* Risk of developing Type II diabetes
* High cholesterol
* Risk of developing heart disease
* Risk of developing endometrial hyperplasia (thickening of the lining of the uterus)
* Risk of developing endometrial cancer

Further reading and information:
The Polycystic Ovarian Syndrome Association has a website at pcosupport.org
or can be reached by telephone at 877-775-PCOS (7267).

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
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http://www.roanoke.com/roatimes/news/story154859.html

Saturday, September 06, 2003

Arsenal told to test water for pollutant

Drinking water to be checked will be supplied to Prices Fork, the plant and parts of Pulaski County.

By MIKE GANGLOFF
THE ROANOKE TIMES

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FAIRLAWN - State regulators this week asked the Radford Army Ammunition Plant to begin testing for the rocket fuel ingredient perchlorate in drinking water it supplies to plant workers, to the new Prices Fork water system in Montgomery County and to parts of Pulaski County.

Since emerging as a national issue in the late 1990s, perchlorate pollution has been found around military bases and defense plants around the country, particularly in California, where the most widespread testing has been conducted. The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency links perchlorate to thyroid damage and tumors, and developmental problems in infants.

At the Radford arsenal, a vast, Army-owned, contractor-operated facility that calls itself the largest propellent manufacturer in North America, perchlorate is one of a number of potentially hazardous substances discovered during a years-long, ongoing effort to clean up waste pits and other sites mostly used before modern environmental laws were in place.

Monte Waugh, a technical services assistant at the Virginia Health Department, said his agency's decision to ask for quarterly perchlorate tests was prompted by arsenal statements in June that perchlorate was found in a 1999 analysis of groundwater at a burial site for waste propellant ash in the eastern tip of the Horseshoe Area, a part of the plant enclosed by a large bend of the New River. Since the result was quite low, showing a concentration of just a few parts per billion, a second groundwater test was performed last year. Results are not yet available, Army arsenal

operations chief Rob Davie wrote in an e-mail this week.

In July and August, The Roanoke Times collected six jars of river water along the Horseshoe Area and sent them to two EPA-certified laboratories for analysis. No perchlorate was found.

The arsenal's main manufacturing area has two water systems that draw from the more than four miles of the New River that flow through the plant. Since late 1998, homes and businesses in the Fairlawn area of Pulaski County have received some of their water from an arsenal system with an intake near the downstream edge of the plant. Montgomery County's new Prices Fork water system draws from the arsenal's other water intake, located near the upstream end of the facility.

The arsenal's water systems operate under the same health department regulations as other public systems in Virginia. But those regulations don't require testing for some of the metals, explosive residues and other substances turned up by the cleanup.

That's because drinking water and environmental cleanup are handled as separate spheres of regulation, Waugh said.

"We don't usually get much information from them," he said of the EPA, which oversees the cleanup at the plant.

In July, EPA spokesman David Sternberg said the agency wasn't aware of plans to pipe water from the arsenal to Prices Fork, and supported more testing for perchlorate around the plant based on its experience at other facilities.

The arsenal's perchlorate use is largely in the past, Davie wrote. Only two products use perchlorate, and they account for less than 0.4 percent of annual production.

The EPA has suggested that perchlorate could affect human health at concentrations as low as 1 part per billion. The U.S. Department of Defense has argued for a limit of 200 ppb. No federal standard is expected soon. At least eight states, although not Virginia, have some form of advisory level for perchlorate.

Bill Walker of the Environmental Working Group, a not-for-profit research organization that follows environmental issues, said national attention to perchlorate seems unlikely to diminish any time soon.

"I believe we have far more to find out than we know, and I believe what we find out is going to be troubling," Walker said Friday from California.

The 21 binders of environmental studies and cleanup plans the arsenal has placed in the Christiansburg branch of the Montgomery-Floyd Regional Library System show that other substances could be reaching drinking water.

A 1999 letter from the EPA mentions that at the same site where perchlorate was found, groundwater is contaminated with HMX, or high-melting explosive.

Davie wrote in an e-mail that there has been "activity" at the site since 1999, but said that the documents that would provide details were not available this week.

The waste site is about 150 feet from the river. Anything in the groundwater is almost certainly reaching the river, said Ernst Kastning, a Radford University professor who studies the porous limestone geology that underlies the arsenal and much of the rest of the region.

Waugh said the health department does not test for HMX. The U.S. Agency for Toxic Substances and Disease Registry says there is limited information about the health effects of HMX, though animal studies suggest the potential for liver and nervous system damage.

A 1999 assessment of ecological risks around the arsenal found lead levels in New River surface water exceeded the EPA action level. But Brian Blankenship, a health department engineer who works with New River Valley water systems, said the arsenal's systems have had no problem passing lead tests, which are performed every three years.

A groundwater study due to be finished this fall at the arsenal is expected to tell more about what substances are reaching the New River.

Davie, the arsenal operations chief, said information generated during the cleanup might be of limited use in designing drinking water safeguards. There's no proof that any of these chemicals are present at the site of either water intake, he wrote in an e-mail.

"Sometimes you can use data from one effort to build on another but that must be done very carefully to avoid missing something," he wrote. Richard Roth, president of the Friends of the New River citizens group, welcomed the new perchlorate testing, saying any fresh information about the river's health was welcome. Montgomery and Pulaski officials also were pleased, saying they relied on the health department to assure the safety of drinking water.

MIKE GANGLOFF: 381-1674

mike.gangloff@...

As you slide down the banister of life, may the splinters never point in the wrong direction! ~Irish Blessing
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¸.·´ .·´¨¨))
((¸¸.·´ ..·´ ,Bee -:¦:- http://beefuddled.ontheweb.com/
-:¦:- ((¸¸.·´*

What is it?

Hi Suzy,

I find it rather sad that in this day and age that a patient would have to "beg" in one form or another for a med that exists and that would help them. I also find it sad and belittling that a doctor who doesn't want to study more about a certain condition and get a grip on how to medicate and READ TESTS and help his patients would flat out refuse to Rx. a med that is natural and works.

Well, I can sum up the last paragraph----in one word..."ignorance". It's not "bliss" to millions of patients who find themselves stricken with thyroid disease. My doctor takes insurance, although is in Ft. Wayne, IN. Another doctor is doing out-of-pocket (but he can give you paperwork to file with your insurance to get reimbursed, I do believe, depending on the insurance) over the phone consults......Dr. Ken Woliner in Florida.

As I look back from where I am now (along with the Sjogrens and the Hashimoto's that was un dx'ed for soooo long, and untreated, I now have osteoporosis, RA, and am going to find out for sure this coming Friday (I hope, maybe more tests) what else. I had been treated for the following: arthritis (with NSAIDS which I can no longer take,,,surgery would have helped more), stones in salivary glands (couldnt' they figure out WHY my bones were getting brittle and that the calcium was even in my blood and heart??), depression (Zoloft for five days-----all I could take), asthma (have a nebulizer, but it turns out I have a sort of fibrosis---they could have found it earlier instead of playing "Drug Rep Roulette" with me.

So you see it is to your advantage to treat what ails you NOW and find someone who knows how to read the tests, and has your best health in mind, not your Ins. Co's. wallet!! I hope you find someone soon who is as good as my Endo---he even found the rheumatic conditions and has referred me to help.

Pam

http://www.annals.org/cgi/content/full/139/5_Part_1/346

Disappearance of Humoral Thyroid Autoimmunity after Complete Removal of Thyroid Antigens

[LINK] Luca Chiovato, MD; Francesco Latrofa, MD; Lewis E. Braverman, MD; Furio Pacini, MD; Marco Capezzone, MD; Lucio Masserini, PhD; Lucia Grasso, PhD; and Aldo Pinchera, MD

2 September 2003 | Volume 139 Issue 5 (Part 1) | Pages 346-351

Background: The development of antibodies to thyroid peroxidase,^ thyroglobulin, and thyroid-stimulating hormone (TSH) receptor^ is a main feature of autoimmune thyroid diseases.^

Objective: To investigate whether complete removal of thyroid^ antigens results in the abatement of humoral thyroid autoimmunity.^

Design: Retrospective chart review study of patients treated^ and monitored with a standard prospective protocol.^

Setting: University hospital in Pisa, Italy, between 1976 and^ 1994.^

Patients: 182 patients with differentiated thyroid carcinoma^ and serum antibodies to thyroid peroxidase, thyroglobulin, or^ TSH receptor due to coexistent clinical Hashimoto thyroiditis,^ Graves disease, or focal autoimmune thyroiditis.^

Intervention: Total thyroidectomy and radioiodine treatment^ to ablate residual or metastatic thyroid tissue. Regular follow-up^ with iodine-131 whole-body scanning and serum thyroglobulin^ measurement. Mean follow-up (±SD) was 10.1 ± 4.1^ years (range, 4 to 20 years).^

Measurements: Serum antibodies to thyroid peroxidase, thyroglobulin,^ and TSH receptor.^

Results: Thyroid peroxidase, thyroglobulin, and TSH-receptor^ antibodies progressively disappeared after the initial treatment.^ The median disappearance time was 6.3 years for thyroid peroxidase^ antibodies and 3.0 years for thyroglobulin antibodies. There^ was a statistically significant correlation between the disappearance^ of thyroid tissue and that of thyroid antibodies. The coexistence^ of Hashimoto thyroiditis or Graves disease with thyroid cancer^ did not modify the pattern of disappearance of thyroid antibody^ compared with patients with focal autoimmune thyroiditis.^

Conclusions: Complete ablation of thyroid tissue with its antigenic^ components results in the disappearance of antibodies to all^ major thyroid antigens, thus supporting the concept that continued^ antibody production depends on the persistence of autoantigen^ in the body.^

Editors' Notes
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Editors Notes

Context

* Theoretically, removal of thyroid^ tissue takes away inciting antigens and halts antibody production^ in patients with autoimmune thyroid disease.

Contribution

* This^ retrospective study from a university thyroid disease center^ describes 4- to 20-year follow-up of 182 patients with differentiated^ thyroid carcinoma and thyroid antibodies due to coexistent autoimmune^ thyroid disease. After thyroidectomy and radioiodine treatment,^ thyroid peroxidase, thyroglubulin, and thyroid-stimulating hormonereceptor^ antibodies gradually disappeared in most patients.

Implications

* Gradual^ disappearance of antibodies suggests that extrathyroidal tissues^ contribute to antibody production but that continued antibody^ production depends on persistence of thyroid antigens.

The^ Editors

^

The development of antibodies to antigenic components of the^ thyroid is a main feature of autoimmune thyroid diseases. The^ main thyroid autoantigens are thyroglobulin, thyroid peroxidase,^ and the thyroid-stimulating hormone (TSH) receptor (1). Thyroglobulin^ and thyroid peroxidase antibodies are also found in some patients^ with differentiated thyroid carcinoma (2), reflecting the occurrence^ of autoimmune thyroiditis in their glands. Antibodies to thyroid^ antigens are mainly produced by lymphocytes infiltrating the^ gland and, to a lesser extent, by immune cells in cervical lymph^ nodes and bone marrow (3). Only rarely do circulating lymphocytes^ spontaneously produce thyroid antibodies (4). Thus, complete^ removal of thyroid tissue would be expected to ablate both thyroid^ antigens and most thyroid antibodysecreting cells. A^ decrease in circulating thyroid antibodies was reported in patients^ with Hashimoto thyroiditis or Graves disease after thyroidectomy^ or
radioiodine treatment (5-7). This is not a universal finding^ (8, 9), however, and complete disappearance of thyroid antibodies^ has been reported in a limited number of patients (10). Thyroid^ antibody changes were also evaluated after total ablation of^ the thyroid by surgery and radioiodine treatment (2, 11). These^ studies, including one performed by our group in the mid-1980s^ on some of the patients described in this paper (2), investigated^ a limited number of patients for a short follow-up, thus preventing^ definitive conclusions about the outcome of thyroid antibodies.^

In the present study, we investigated whether surgical removal^ of the thyroid followed by radioablation of thyroid tissue by^ radioiodine (iodine-131) could lead to the disappearance of^ antibodies to the 3 main thyroid antigens. We studied a large^ group of patients with differentiated thyroid carcinoma who^ had serum thyroid peroxidase, thyroglobulin, or TSH-receptor^ antibodies due to coexistent thyroid autoimmune disease.^

Methods
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[LINK] Top
[INLINE] Methods
[LINK] Results
[LINK] Discussion
[LINK] Author & Article Info
[LINK] References

Patients

Starting from the early 1970s, we regularly searched for thyroid^ antibodies in any patient with thyroid cancer who was referred^ to our central treatment hospital in Pisa, Italy. Of 1420 consecutive^ patients with differentiated thyroid carcinoma referred between^ 1976 and 1994, 505 patients had positive test results for thyroid^ antibodies. Among them, 203 patients were not eligible for the^ present study because they had already been treated with thyroidectomy^ in other hospitals. On the basis of the time course of decrease^ in thyroid antibody titers observed in a previous pilot study^ (2), we decided to include only those patients with a follow-up^ of 4 years or more. Thus, 102 patients were excluded because^ they did not fulfill this requirement. The remaining 182 patients^ with positive test results for thyroid peroxidase, thyroglobulin,^ or TSH-receptor antibodies (151 females and 31 males; mean age^ [±SD], 39.7 ± 13.7 [range, 6 to 81 years]) entered^ the study.
Patients included in the present study were not more^ severely ill and did not show a higher mortality rate than patients^ who were excluded. The institutional review board approved the^ study, and patients provided informed consent.^

Thyroid carcinoma was suspected by fine-needle aspiration cytology.^ The diagnosis of clinical Hashimoto thyroiditis was based on^ a typical rubbery goiter associated with high titers of thyroid^ peroxidase or thyroglobulin antibodies. The diagnosis of Graves^ disease coexistent with thyroid carcinoma was based on the presence^ of overt hyperthyroidism; diffuse hyperfunctioning goiter containing^ a distinct nonfunctioning nodule; and positive test results^ for thyroid antibodies, including TSH-receptor antibodies.^

Thyroid peroxidase and thyroglobulin antibodies were measured^ by passive agglutination using commercial kits by Miles Laboratories,^ Inc. (Elkhart, Indiana), through the early 1980s and by Fujizoki^ (Tokyo, Japan) thereafter. A 1:100 titer was considered positive^ if confirmed in a second test on the same sample. Thyroid-stimulating^ hormonereceptor antibodies were assessed by a radioreceptor^ assay or by in vitro bioassays. Thyroglobulin was measured by^ an immunoradiometric method (sensitivity, 3 µg/L) (Sorin,^ Saluggia, Italy). In this assay, the presence of thyroglobulin^ antibodies in serum results in false low values for thyroglobulin.^

Treatment and Follow-up Procedures

Several cancer specialists in the same center used a standard^ prospective protocol to treat patients and monitor them over^ time. Data about treatment that was actually received and outcomes^ were assessed retrospectively from chart review. Initial treatment^ involved near-total or total thyroidectomy, with resection of^ metastatic lymph nodes when evident at surgery, followed by^ ablation of residual thyroid tissue with iodine-131. Subsequent^ treatment consisted of l-thyroxine at TSH-suppressive doses;^ iodine-131 for functioning metastatic lesions; and surgery,^ with or without radiation therapy and chemotherapy, for nonfunctioning^ metastatic lesions. A total of 93 patients received more than^ 1 dose of iodine-131. Follow-up examination consisted of periodic^ chest radiography, iodine-131 whole-body scanning, and serum^ thyroglobulin measurements (at least yearly) in patients receiving^ and not receiving l-thyroxine. Thyroid peroxidase and thyroglobulin^ antibodies were
measured at least yearly during the follow-up.^ In the 1990s, neck ultrasonography was performed yearly to search^ for metastatic lymph node lesions or local recurrences of thyroid^ carcinoma. Chest radiography, computed tomography or magnetic^ resonance imaging, bone radiography, and bone scintigraphy were^ used to search for nonfunctioning metastatic lesions when metastasis^ was suspected on clinical grounds or because serum thyroglobulin^ level was elevated despite a negative iodine-131 whole-body^ scan. Complete ablation of thyroid tissue was defined by two^ consecutive scans demonstrating no evidence of residual thyroid^ tissue or persistent cancer (negative iodine-131 whole-body^ scan), a serum thyroglobulin concentration less than 3 µg/L^ in patients without thyroglobulin antibodies and not receiving^ l-thyroxine treatment, and negative ecographic and imaging findings.^ Serum thyroglobulin could be used as a marker of persistent^ thyroid tissue only in patients who
had negative test results^ for thyroglobulin antibodies. Disappearance of thyroid peroxidase,^ thyroglobulin, or TSH-receptor antibodies was defined by negative^ test results obtained in patients not receiving l-thyroxine^ treatment. The mean (±SD) follow-up period after initial^ treatment was 10.1 ± 4.1 years (range, 4 to 20 years).^ One hundred eight patients (59%) were followed for 8 years,^ and 69 patients (38%) were followed for 12 years. Three patients^ were lost during follow-up. Four patients died of cancer: 3^ patients with papillary cancer and 1 patient with follicular^ thyroid carcinoma.^

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